Going to Seminary Gets a Facelift

Wow… it is 2:56 a.m. and it is finally finished. If I wasn’t so exhausted I’d explain how INCREDIBLY difficult this conversion was. Well, I hope you like the new digs… I’ll be tweaking it here and there over the next couple weeks, so feel free to let me know what you think.

…sleepy time…

Vintage Hypocrite

Therefore, confess your sins to one another and pray for one another, that you may be healed.
James 5:16a

Well… I feel dirty just saying it… I took my laptop to class today.

Despite my outspoken advocacy of Vintage Notes, I broke down and took the mac to campus. Now, before you break out the stones and begin tossing them at me, allow me to give my reasoning:

1. Access to the Greek and Hebrew - I’m currently taking a class on the book of Hebrews and the professor often encourages us to look at the Greek… I haven’t taken Greek yet, so looking at it does nothing for me. However, having the computer there allows me to pull of the original language and look at it and better understand what is going on… well, a little bit at least.
2. I’m a tree hugging hippie - Well, not really… but two of my professors offer their lecture outlines online and I hate wasting the paper to take them to class to write notes on them… especially when I plan on taking them home and entering them into the computer. It just doesn’t make sense.

Now, let me make a couple observations as one who was a pure Vintage Note taker until today.

1. Temptation - I never knew how INCREDIBLY tempting it was to get online, check email, set system preferences, organize my folders, download notes for other classes, set new wallpaper image, etc, while in class. It drive me crazy when I see people doing it, and yet, today I had to concentrate not to do it. It was a challenge to say the least! I think I did a good job for the most part, but I don’t know… it is HARD to not do anything but take notes and use my bible software.
2. Repentance - Paper is better! Seriously, I really do think it is better. I found myself getting a bit lazy when I had the professors notes sitting right in front of me… essentially all the important stuff was already there. So, I just sat and listened (trying not to go online). Conversely, when all I have is my notepad in front of me I am forced to think about what is said and what I need to remember. Also, I really do like being able to write all over the page and draw lines, arrows, circles, and other visual clues to my notes… but that might just be me.

Conclusion - I’ll probably continue to take my computer and use it as a support tool, however, I intend to keep Vintage Notes as my primary approach to note taking.

Whew… I feel better now that I’ve got that off my chest.

Expectation Versus Reality in Seminary and Beyond

I don’t know what the deal is, but I’ve been reading a lot of research about seminary lately. This latest reading was a dissertation by Charles R. DeGroat who teaches at Reformed Theological Seminary (RTS). The work (made available here) looks into expectation versus reality among male graduates of seminary who entered the ministry.

In the work, DeGroat focuses on 7 graduates of RTS who, after graduation, went into parish ministry. The purpose of the study was to examine the relationship between expectations formed in seminary and the relationship to the reality experienced within the pastorate. For those of us who are M.Div students or those consider the pastorate after seminary, I would HIGHLY recommend reading the dissertation. Specifically, since I know you’re busy and probably aren’t looking to add another 156 pages to your reading list, I would recommend that you focus on the meaning units expressed by the 7 participants and DeGroat’s textural and structural descriptions (p.40-123).

In this section you can hear the thoughts of men (read the limitations section for why the study only included men) who have been in our shoes (as seminarians) and have since gone on to experience the reality of what we seek (the pastorate… and yes, I know that we’re not all going into the pastorate, I’m just talking to those who are.). In studying what these men share I believe that we have the opportunity to see the weaknesses in our seminary experience and, on our own initiative, take steps necessary to ensure that we will be better prepared to serve those to whom God will call us.

As a word of warning, don’t discount the study by saying, “oh, well my seminary is not like that one.” The reality is that no seminary truly provides a holistic preparation for ministry. Hearing the experience of these pastors will help you to see where their seminary failed to prepare them and will allow you to examine your experience more critically… hopefully resulting in a more successful seminary experience for you.

For those too lazy to download and read for your self (shame on you) here are just a FEW quotes from these pastors that I found enlightening as a seminarian and future pastor:

• I had to do a funeral three weeks into my first gig in ministry and I didn’t have freaking clue what to do.
• I wish I learned more about a number of practical ministry things - Weddings. Pastoral counseling. A dude’s kid was molested at one point, and I thought “some good my class notes are for this.” I mean, are you getting the disconnect?
• I expected that I’d grow spiritually in seminary. I didn’t. And then, I expected that I’d grow spiritually after seminary. And that happened a little. But it mostly didn’t happen. Because the busyness just doesn’t stop. You move from the busyness of papers and essays and exams to the busyness of getting a job to the busyness of preparing for ordination to the busyness of phone calls and hospital visits and teachings and kids being born and interviews with guys like you.
• If I could say one thing to the seminary, I’d say it’s no use graduating pastors who know how to pass an exam but are spiritually dead.
• And now I’m realizing that, as I reflect on my seminary experience, is that it was just too much information to absorb and process. So, you scramble to perform to pass tests, and to get credentialed, and to become a preacher. My seminary experience became a means to an end.
• Nothing in seminary helped with the relational difficulties I’d experience in ministry. The bulk of it I gained in my first ministry position. I saw the level of pain, level of fragmentation, level of brokenness in people’s lives.
• I didn’t realize how much emotionally energy this (ministry) would require. It’s gigantic.
• Seminary provided important information for theological and ecclesiastical exams, but not for ministering to broken people.
• I spend far more time, for good or bad, worrying over how to deal with conflict, or help marriages on the brink of disaster or the best way to accommodate more people, or how to get a group of men who are all older than I, and whom I fear a bit, to get on the same page about something, all relational sorts of things than I do about the exegesis of particular passages of scripture.
• It is awfully tempting to give one’s time and energy to the things that make it look like you are on the job. I don’t believe I had a good sense of just how much this would be a temptation.

Foreign Missionay Needs Seminary Advice

OK everyone, time to help someone out. I was contacted by Dan and Chris who are missionaries in Poland. They have 2 daughters and are considering going to seminary. Below is a letter explaining their situation and they have asked for our help. So, please take a moment to read it and leave a comment for them. Thanks!

Dan (my husband) talked about going to seminary back in the States a few months ago. It was suggested that we also look in Europe and see what we find here. We have everything to set up house here, etc. We found a listing of accredited Seminaries at EEAA. Through there, we found Tyndale University. For an MDiv, it costs about 3700 Euro (about $5000) per year. We went last week to visit it, talk about living expenses, and see about the programs. The program appears to be very good, and they accepted and scholarshipped him about 50%. The living expenses are fairly high, probably about the same as Chicago or LA. Our outstanding problem at this time is our daughters, aged 13 and 15. Amsterdam has some Dutch schools which teach in English but for the two of them to attend, it costs about 12,000 Euro ($19,000) per year. We thought about taking out student loans to cover their tuition and I will work to cover most of our living expenses. We possibly could continue their education with the online school we have been using, but hope that if this option is available to them, that it would make it easier for them to transition into college. (So, we would have 2 years of education expense for Brittney and 4 for Melanie) They will continue giving us some form of assistance, possibly through the Dutch government or through the school itself, but first we would have to pay the first half.

If you have any ideas/suggestions about attending seminary overseas, scholarships, loans, etc., we would welcome any help or advice, good or bad. Some people might be interested in this university as well, since it is fully accredited and somewhat cheaper, especially if it is a couple (and can possibly stomach dorm life) or for single people.

Ok everyone… thoughts?

Two Cent Tuesday - Readership Poll

I’m just interested to know where the Going to Seminary readers are on this journey called seminary.

(answer #5 was added for all you Calvinists out there who objected to question #4’s wording… come on, that was funny!)

Educational Debt Payments After Seminary

Sorry to post another dismal post about debt, but it is a harsh reality we need to wrestle with.

As stated before, this information comes from a survey conducted by The Association of Theological Schools (ATS). The survey questioned 5,113 graduates from the 2006-2007 school year, covering 130 seminaries.

Today, we look at what the Educational Debt Incurred at Seminary translates to on a monthly basis. Of the 5,113 seminary graduates, here is how much their monthly educational debt payment will be:

MONTHLY EDUCATIONAL DEBT PAYMENT
42.4% - None
15.9% - Less than $200
21.1% - $200 to $349
11.7% - $350 to $499
7.9% - $500 to $1,000
1.1% - More than $1,000

Now, something I failed to mention the other day was that this is STRICTLY educational debt. Who knows how much those payments will be if it were to include credit cards or car payments.

This is a big burden that you must truly weigh when you think about seminary.

Googling to Seminary

After months of hard work we’ve finally claimed the #1 spot for the search query “going to seminary” on google.

For the last 4 months I’ve been #2 on this results… behind some blog post some guy wrote in 2006.

My goal… however ludicrous it might be, is to get #1 ranking on the search “seminary” … yeah, I know, I said it was ludicrous.

Educational Debt Incurred at Seminary

I was reading the results from survey conducted by The Association of Theological Schools (ATS) this evening and was fascinated by some of the findings. The survey was conducted on graduating students from member schools of the ATS and included 5,113 graduates representing 130 member schools (so, yeah, a good sampling).

Over the next week I hope to post some of the stats that came out of the study. Don’t worry, I know we’re all busy seminarians, so I’ll break it down into bite sized nuggets.

Also, I’d like to say that this information I’ll post from this survey is pretty important to think through, especially if you are considering or just starting seminary. We have a chance to see and hear what people who are finishing this journey have to say… we’d be wise to listen.

Tonight’s post is on the stats concerning Educational Debt Incurred at Seminary. Out of the 5,113 graduating respondents, these are the percentages for the amount of educational debt they incurred while in seminary.

EDUCATIONAL DEBT INCURRED AT SEMINARY
46.4% - None
11.1 % - Less than $10,000
13.2% - $10,000 to $19,999
9.9% - $20,000 to $29,999
7.6% - $30,000 to $39,999
11.7% - More than $40,000

Two observations:

1. WOW! Almost 50% graduated with NO debt. THAT is great.
2. WOW! Almost 20% graduated with $30,000 + in debt. THAT is not great.

With the average Senior Pastor salary paying about $37,000 for pastors fresh out of seminary… $30K in debt is a BIG deal. Now, I’m not throwing stones at anyone who has a loan or debt (I have some). But you must be aware that vocational ministry is not a lavish position. Incurring large amounts of debt in seminary will add a huge amount of stress to a very stressful job… and if you don’t think being a pastor is stressful… then go talk to one.

The Art of Distraction

I am the KING of being distracted. However, I tend to be distracted by things that are actually important. The bad thing about that is I feel justified and guilty at the same time.

I find myself having a plan for the day and easily diverting from that plan in order to accomplish something that, yes needs to be done, but yet isn’t on the plan. For example, I’m a web developer. To pay the bills I make websites. In order to maintain a balanced life I schedule out my week to a fairly precise timing. There is a time for work, a time for study, a time for class, and a time for family. Now, if I would stick to the schedule I actually think I’d get a WHOLE lot more done. However, while studying I check email… checking email leads to check a blog leads to editing a blog leads to answering a clients question leads to fixing a glitch on their site leads to…. spending my entire study time working.

I don’t have any answers here… so this post is basically pointless… except for the fact that it is distracting me from (let me look at the schedule)… yup, reading.

Do I need to post? Yes. Was I supposed to post 5 hours ago so I could be reading now? (sigh) Yes.

Anyone have any tips on keeping to your schedule… I’m a pro at making them… it is keeping them that I find difficult. Help?

Where is eveyone?

It has been quiet around here the past couple days. I thought for sure that the E.R. Video and the Setting Goals posts would bring some good discussion. Where is everyone?

Bueller, Bueller, Bueller…

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